Curse

Takumi Tan · May 11, 2011, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Possible to show the heroes build template?

LexTalionis · May 11, 2011, 04:59 PM // 16:59

Oh - sorry, went to take an early night's nap. Builds are easy enough:

Dervish template: OgOjoarLLPvX9Lwb+SuJwqXEMA

Mesmers using: OQhjAwCc4MnAS30z0hTzBI/LGA
(switch elite as needed. Stacked Complicate is very strong)

SoS Rit: OAmkEeiM5Yqz10bixmcMTfcNeHD
Attributes 12+1+4 Channeling, 7+1 Resto 3+1 Spawning 10 Command (a bit schizophrenic. Possible to drop spirit light, was just testing if additional support was needed for AoD (it wasn't)

OOU Necro: OANFQRxW2znESFVQAxLhRTV1WoiA
Death Major, SR Major

ST Rit: OAOk8YgcoQuD20694ObBk7ay1ZC

Blood Necro: OANEQqtH+GdHMDRDVGEQ8SUV1IC
13 Blood, 12 SR, 10 Curses, 6 Prot prayers

As TheJosip mentioned, it's perhaps a bit too defensive; you can scale some of it down (it still kills very quickly as long as you wait for the MM or if you take Ebon Vanguard Standard of Honor, but this might also be due to my contribution as a Wastrel Mesmer). The basic idea behind the new build though is that I'm finding 3 copies of Aegis chained are superior to 1 copy of Displacement. I'm thinking of dropping Union and getting more offense, perhaps attack spirits using FoxBat's AI tips on Shelter.

Carboplatin · May 11, 2011, 05:08 PM // 17:08

So your dervishes have 2 points in scythe mastery. Is that intentional?

Kraviec · May 11, 2011, 05:27 PM // 17:27

they mostly kill with splinter weapon anyways ;p

LexTalionis · May 11, 2011, 05:31 PM // 17:31

They don't use scythes when you're using the pure Dwayna healer (should be set on passive so she doesn't pull everything in 3 aggro bubbles), so it doesn't matter. The version of Dwaynaway that uses scythes uses banishing strike, splinter, sand shards and grenth's fingers, none of which care about your scythe actually doing damage.

Just looked at my build after waking up and realised that the SoS Ritualist and MM's secondaries should be swapped. Fall Back! is best on a MM, for obvious reasons.

Going to test it out in a few HM runs and make the build better, will update the post with template codes if needed.

mugen · May 11, 2011, 07:16 PM // 19:16

finally full doa (3 runs)

time are irrevelant many pauses
http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/2994/gw161.jpg
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/6190/gw164y.jpg
http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/5803/gw184p.jpg
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/6269/gw171v.jpg

~3h30 if i add times

except mallyx
http://imageshack.us/m/717/1207/gw186e.jpg
wondering how i can kill him with 3 * full enchants char & 2 * full hex

well i dont care, just happy i ve cleaned doa with 3 Dervish & 1 paragon !

ps : i ve tried your "super healer" version but it didnt impress

When i deserve failing, i failed, even with 2 or 3 of them

LexTalionis · May 11, 2011, 07:37 PM // 19:37

Er, don't use enchantments on Mallyx, very very bad idea and Dwayna can't handle that. Good job with the DOA though! Congratulations!

The straight up healer was mainly designed to be used with OOU + Bone Fiends. Like I said, it requires monk enchantments for the AI to function properly, but it's quite possible I'm getting skewed results (I average a 100-250 life heal every 5-7 seconds with signets inbetween though).

Temporarily dumped the ST for an ER Prot and made an interesting discovery - rather than bind Release Enchantments, it's quite possible just to bind Dwayna's Sorrow and cast it every time it gets consumed. Forcing Dwayna's Sorrow without specifying a target will make your hero cast it on himself (and usually hit the Dervish) - it's unable to auto target minions. Much less micro involved, but it's less reliable than triggering Release directly, (Hero Flee AI can take precedence when being hit by AoEs).

edit: Even easier solution, use a macro keyboard and make a 2 sequence keybind to target the Dervish directly and hit her with it. Live Vicariously works too. Of course, still completely unnecessary if you use Aegis chains.

Julia Gg · May 12, 2011, 02:27 AM // 02:27

No problems with The Dragon's Lair in HM

Arctica · May 13, 2011, 06:28 AM // 06:28

Been testing this team build for a while now.

Managed to do BLA with my dervish with only one party wipe, which is great taking into consideration that I had never been able to do it without 5 or 6 party wipes or a few failures before. And I did not use an MM for it

Then did some Wanted HM stuff with my mesmer. I did some minor changes to the build of the necro and spec'd in curses instead of death magic, using MoP and barbs. Worked like charm.

The good thing is that the dervishes can keep ebon sin alive for a relatively long time.

Thank you for the build suggestion. Something totally new and very flexible. I just love it.

North Devon Dog · May 13, 2011, 06:33 PM // 18:33

I was a bit sceptical but am sold I really like the Dervs.

Didn't really see the point of the rest of the build on my ranger so tried a sword SY spammer with spirit spam and one mesmer. I did some quick testing in the foundry HM and used 3 dervs, dunno why, guess I wasn't expecting much and just went in for fun.

Rooms 1 and 2 running in no strategy- cleared no problem.

Room 3, started to take it seriously, reasonably careful pulls - cleared at least as quick as my normal build. Logged out because of time.

Thanks for the build, I am already trying to think how best to run this. I will say the near constant SY you can get with LB sig makes for great defence but need to test further outside DoA.

Anyway my question. What sort of damage does do the Dervs do. One skill says Holy and one says Earth. Which one wins? I was thinking about what would be the best support character for them. I am assuming things that buff physical won't work on the Dervs due to the change in damage type.

Thanks

EDIT: Just spent the last half hour testing again. Got wiped in both Foundary and City HM. Was actually trying this time. Think I got lucky first time. Even so am gonna change build and test some more, would still like to know about damage type

shaygo · May 13, 2011, 08:00 PM // 20:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by mugen

finally full doa (3 runs)

time are irrevelant many pauses
http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/2994/gw161.jpg
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/6190/gw164y.jpg
http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/5803/gw184p.jpg
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/6269/gw171v.jpg

~3h30 if i add times

well i dont care, just happy i ve cleaned doa with 3 Dervish & 1 paragon !

ps : i ve tried your "super healer" version but it didnt impress

When i deserve failing, i failed, even with 2 or 3 of them

That's really nice !

I guess using SY! helps... I'm playing with my necro so cant use SY!
my main problem is foundry, I've managed to clear all other areas with 7 heros.
it would help if you post the templates, I'll try it tomorrow.

LexTalionis · May 13, 2011, 09:08 PM // 21:08

Foundry is more an issue of careful pulling and target preparation. Other than bad pulling (learn how to use a longbow!) wipes are generally caused by two things: Rage titans and Rage Titans. Rage Titans spawn from Misery Titans, which are much less scary, so I tend to focus fire them down one by one. Complicate is pretty good here.

I mix a pure Dwayna healer with half a single target one for the Foundry, but I think other builds can definitely work, it needs testing. I wouldn't recommend scythes unless you're willing to do a lot of micro to avoid linked pulls, but when I've tried it, Splinter + Earth Shards takes care of huge groups pretty quickly.

@North Devon Dog: It should follow normal stacking rules. First in; First out. AoD + Staggering force in that order would make you do Holy damage > converted> Earth damage in the end.

I'm really glad people are having success with the build (and their own personal variations), and it's definitely improvable. Remember - you don't have to use 2 Dwayna dervishes, sometimes I find 1 is quite enough if you have the strong need for a different elite (like UA). I'd try improving on it more, but lately I've been off on a few other GW testing projects, sorry. Keep it up!

North Devon Dog · May 13, 2011, 11:01 PM // 23:01

Thanks for the reply, although I still have some mixed info on what actually buffs certain skills in terms of damage type, for instance Ebon Honour discription is very mis-leading (works really well with 4 physical).

Also with max respect to your comments, I know how to play and pull in Foundary which was why I was amazed when I ran in with a sword thinking the build would fold, and it made room 3 no probs. Lets be clear- when I test I am talking pulling 2 mobs which is why I always test in City and Foundry. First time this build caned foundry like you said, no micro, running in like fool. ( to be fair 1.5 mobs, we had already killed a few when i pulled the 2nd)

Anyway did foundry with 3 derv 1 ranger using an extra splinter on the ST and a necro SoS healer. Took me a bit longer with very careful pulling and spirit placement. Only death was me but then I don't have an extra 100 armour. Had to use 3 clovers.

LexTalionis · May 14, 2011, 06:02 AM // 06:02

@North Devon Dog: Oh, well, pardon me for assuming. I have all of 2 weeks of experience with the Foundry, to be honest; so you actually have the advantage on me there! (Never stepped into the DoA for 3 years) :P

manddras · May 15, 2011, 06:03 PM // 18:03

Hi guys, i saw that there's a lot of "SY" for dwaynaway but, even if this build is very very effective against everything, i've a big issue with DoA HM (especially foundry, even in nm)

I've an elementalist with some wards but i fail again and again and again. Have you any solutions for primarly casters professions ? Or do i need cons ? (dunno want use cons'...but well...)

LexTalionis · May 15, 2011, 07:15 PM // 19:15

It's not very very effective against everything, I never claimed that - just effective on about 95% of the stuff in the game.

There's quite a few things it's weak to, like nasty environmental effects, huge spike damage, AoD being interrupted (Bring Pious Concentration or precast it) and Mallyx. I personally wouldn't use the scythe version of AoD Dervishes in the DoA HM because of the City of Torc'qua and Ravenheart Gloom, for example (though the staff version is still viable).

Save Yourselves users are lucky because Dwaynaway is fantastic when combined with Save Yourselves to completely negate any non armor-ignoring damage on the rest of your team very easily. They can probably largely ignore Rage Titans and other Elementalists. For casters, you'll probably have to pull really really carefully in the DoA HM and rely on careful flagging, good use of Panic and caster disruption. The DoA HM really isn't a place where I can afk through.

I've managed to complete the Foundry, Stygian Veil and Ravenheart Gloom in HM with a Dwayna healer as a primary mesmer, so it's definitely possible, but it might frankly be more trouble than it's worth. If you intend to farm the DoA HM, it'd probably save a lot more time just to reroll a paragon or assassin.

edit: Or maybe you could just try perma Obsidian Flesh tanking? It can't be too different from perma ShadowForm.

Plutoman · May 16, 2011, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by LexTalionis

edit: Or maybe you could just try perma Obsidian Flesh tanking? It can't be too different from perma ShadowForm.

It is, it's not as mobile with all the extra casting times. It can work, but moving the heroes around is most definitely a pain because you have to coordinate heroes while tanking and balling at the same time. It can work, but it takes more effort to be sure.

AcousticMeanie · May 16, 2011, 05:15 AM // 05:15

I've had success running the above along side a very similar Dwayna Orders D/N. Between the two they provide all the healing and protection needed for basic encounters. If Orders aren't necessary a second one of these is an excellent options as is or with slight variations (i.e. Conviction with Draw Conditions).

That combination with a basic dual Mes mid-line allows the player to plug in just about any other 3 hero setup and still be free to bring whatever they want. Similar to your build, I bring a spirit spam setup with my Rit but also have great success running an imba + 3 paragon setup as well.

aspi · May 16, 2011, 11:38 AM // 11:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by mugen

finally full doa (3 runs)

time are irrevelant many pauses
http://img585.imageshack.us/img585/2994/gw161.jpg
http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/6190/gw164y.jpg
http://img853.imageshack.us/img853/5803/gw184p.jpg
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/6269/gw171v.jpg

~3h30 if i add times

except mallyx
http://imageshack.us/m/717/1207/gw186e.jpg
wondering how i can kill him with 3 * full enchants char & 2 * full hex

well i dont care, just happy i ve cleaned doa with 3 Dervish & 1 paragon !

ps : i ve tried your "super healer" version but it didnt impress

When i deserve failing, i failed, even with 2 or 3 of them

Nice job, do you mind posting the first ss a bit bigger? My eyes are not so good anymore. thanks.

majoho · May 16, 2011, 03:17 PM // 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by LexTalionis

Just looked at my build after waking up and realised that the SoS Ritualist and MM's secondaries should be swapped. Fall Back! is best on a MM, for obvious reasons.

You mean so your MM can slow you entire group down instead of lagging behind

Personally I was in love with ST at some point but recently I found it not so good, most of the time having two chars with secondary prot skills works just as good (Aegis, Prot. Spirit) in cases where you don't micro Prots works better (which means what you made this build for).

Also this build really needs a char with Dwaynas Kiss and Dwaynas Sorrow especially the last one.

Finally, IF you are using a variant with scythes you'd be better off actually putting points in them, I totally get that the damage isn't supposed to come from the weapon but it's simply stupid NOT to put points in it (and drop wind-prayers).